gone baby gone

[jj]

...i can't believe she's actually 'really gone'...hoped the real life tv drama would end up in perhaps further mass confusion but 'happy', like the movie

http://www.thestar.com/fpLarge/video/617145

if this is a bernardo/homolka copycat thing, i hope the abducting woman is not given a light sentence for striking a deal while testifying against the boyfriend murderer

there are helicopters to the north west of my property, it's sad....off to fetch the kid from school, a common parental routine these days in this neck of the woods

[charlene]

give harrison a big hug...
I've been sitting here with no desire to move after watching the coverage on tv. words cannot express the contempt and disgust i have for those involved in this horrid event.
sad sad sad..

[charlene]

hey james - kenyon is covering it for The Star..he's in woodstock..

[jj]

seems lil' Victoria and her bro were the only two well adjusted individuals in this mixed bag of characters, many abandoned

innocence lost, like she was ripped right from the pages of a Leacock or Twain novel, but tragically this was non-fiction

will be revising my street smart advise to jr going forward

i hope Tori is toying with tadpoles in a truly harmless afterlife

bet the accused two will be free by their mid 30's and 50's

...mixed thoughts re amber alert policy, so many cry wolf

ok, i am less mad today, and hopefully less naive tomorrow

[charlene]

I said same to Lisa yesterday - it seems like a disaster waiting to happen in some way or another..

teaching street smarts goes out the window when these predators set forth on their mission..that child, as so many before her, behaved as a child will with an older, bigger person and listen to them and not what their parents have taught. it's the nature of the naive and innocent.

[brink-]

This type of crime has become all too common....if it happens once it happens too often. I was stunned when Homolka was released from prison and that her family still has contact with her. I read somewhere that she has a child now, I wonder if she worries about what will happen to her child. At least Bernardo is losing what is left of his mind by sitting in a very small cell for the rest of eternity.

I wonder what happens to a persons mind to do this. It is just impossible to understand. An eye for an eye.......

[jj]

hi deb...i think homolka had plastic surgery of some sort to help with new ID and location, didn't know about child...i heard that one of the boys who horrifically led Jamie Bulger to his fate also is free with new ID and child...i hope he can now, in part, feel the immense love for the child and the immense horror he would experience if someone were to abduct his child...in their case, for simple kicks

i am not a csi, law and order, etc viewer but i try get to the bottom line of 'motive' when these real life cases are eventually revealed

the common thread in some of the recent one seems to be a blend of sexual obsession and partner approval/power

recently a boy stabbed and killed a 12 year old girl simply becuse his girlfriend was tormenting him with text messages demanding that he do it if he wanted her 'rewards'

a few years back seemingly ordinary guy grabbed a wonderful young girl in plain daylight...there was no partner in that case but he confessed he was overcome by a growing obsession http://members.shaw.ca/pdg/briere_michael.html

i am speculating but this girl who lured Tori may have been seeking approval (so insecure) from her boyfriend by bringing him a prize....i hope no photos/video was taken in the short time they had the poor girl...it's sick to thing they could be somewhere on the net and/of on pedi's hard drives

as far as the act of abduction, the only chance someone seems to have is at the VERY instance of the abduction...i imagine this 18 year old female said to Tori as she left school, that there was some sort of family emergency and she was there at Tori's mom's request to take her to the hospital or wherever...what street dumb or smart kid would second guess this type of ploy, especially coming from a female (stereotypically less creepy then a guy stranger)
...it was amazing that video footage of a portion of the abduction was captured and published for public assistnce and it worked...same true of the Jamie Bulger mall video stills

back when i read how homolka and bernardo schemed to abduct Kristen French, it made me totally ill...karla got out her car with a map pretending to be lost...then good teen citizen Kristen trying to assist was unsuspectingly blindsided at knifepoint and shoved into the car...broad daylight in a church parking lot

sure, isolated instances but the seemingly normal individuals involved in these examples (like this current 28 year old guy/alleged murderer) put folks on edge when it's so hard to judge a book by it's cover...man, it wasn't uncommon for me to meander, alone, through a ravine on my trek home in elementary school years...now seems insane

...then there's the 2 punks killed a 15 gentle teen on his way home from school as he walked through a small field...this is not in the courts yet but i believe this will be a 'gang approval act' motive...how do you possibly overcome that sort of nonsense

when i was very young, my friends and i were within half an hour of being the first to shockingly stumble upon a deceased female teen victim in 'our play field'....a man walking his dog got their first (oh, thank goodness for us wee ones) and kept us away until police arrived...i remember my folks stumbling for words when i peppered them with the 'hows and WHYs?'....that crime remains unsolved...i was sad for a long time following that event and a part of me holds onto that helpless feeling whenever senseless loss (not to mention, horror) occurs, some of it right under the publics nose ...if i interpreted it right, i think the subtext of the "No country for old men" conveyed that type of un-policeable helplessness pretty well

deb, that was a long winded tangent attempting to address the "what happens to a person's mind" part of your post...the short version is 'i really have no idea' other than i understand what obsession feels like but more as it applies to being obsessed with completing a song or a house project and ok, also can remember being obsessed with dating certain women, same age or older to the point that my body chemistry was haywire...if this is what these folks somehow feel for children and they have voices inside telling them to act, well, it's a society deflating illness with no remedy, imo

[jj]

Originally Posted by charlene

hey james - kenyon is covering it for The Star..he's in woodstock..

thanks for shedding some further light/dark on this character (still technically innocent, mind you), Kenyon...i suppose you could take in some Shakespeare while you're out near Stratford ...at least you're getting pretty good weather while covering a pretty dreary story

http://www.thestar.com/News/Ontario/article/638574

[charlene]

it seems that the 18 year old girl knew tori's mum thru their common oxycontin drug use..

[jj]

Originally Posted by brink-

An eye for an eye.......

below is a wonderful photo of this radiant child with her loving brother...i wish he was as side by side that day on the way home from school (what an understatement)

a question i have is: there is some law that says a child cannot be left alone at home if under 12....but it is ok to be alone out in public is it....seems odd to me....and why wasnt a panic set in at about 4pm instead of 6pm...was there nobody home...i think an amber alert at 6 or 7pm may have been far too late

anyhow, the memorial is tomorrow and it is sad there is still no body brought home...me and neighbours have searched as requested but seems fruitless

her last gift to her mom was a heart for moms day that read Love your enemies....I am not a person who has much hate but i really do feel hate for this alleged set of abductors-kidnappers-murderers...it is tragic enough that little ones lose a precious life to disease or an accident but this is ghastly

this couple may have been desperate for money (child trafficking or sell internet photos) for their drug fix but that is NO excuse....i could endorse the eye for an eye justice in this case...we could resurrect the gallows of the don jail...if the guy is innocent then this tough gal really is a cunning one

will be there tomorrow in spirit, Woodstock...and visit a dedicated Victoria Parkette someday soon

[brink-]

Updates?

JJ, that must have been horrid for you as a child. Even not seeing her, knowing that she was left there - where you and your friends would walk must have set you back. I imagine you walked through there with an extra eye on the ground after that. What a way to lose the innocence of childhood. I am glad the dogwalker had presence of mind to keep you away.

[jj]

D, first, no updates really...just a bunch of satellite court appearances that seem to accomplish nothing other than setting next court date for each of the accused...i heard through a bit of an insider that they have little concrete on him other than her negotiated testimony...potentially deflating...then again, if he was set up by her and somehow incredibly innocent, i feel for the guy...btw, there was a memorial service for Tori, still not found

ok, as for the perplexed childhood experience...seems i was older than i thought (almost a teen) but still rural naive and still relatively wee ...i found this cold case reference cos I've always remembered her name but not quite how to spell it...we didnt actually stumble on the scene first or even at all so not sure where they got that tidbit but the eery thing is that we had been doing evil kneivel bike jumps on other dirt piles within eyesight of 'that' mound for hours earlier that afternoon...can't believe she was there for most of the beautiful summer's day before noticed, sad

during an errand, i returned to see my old school 2 years ago for first time in 1/4 century...i went over to that spot which is now paved over as part of quite a large lot...so many changes and quite an ethnic area now...i felt old

"●At 5:30 on the afternoon of Thursday, August 21st, 1975, two young boys riding their bikes on mounds of top soil on the grounds of German Mills Public School at 61 Simonston Blvd. in Thornhill, just north of Toronto, stumbled upon the dead body of a young woman. She was 18-year-old Tracy Kundinger, who lived with her parents on nearby Monsanto Ct. She had been strangled with a piece of twine. There was no sexual assault. She had not been reported missing because her parents were away on holiday and she was home alone.
Police believed Kundinger, returning from her summer job as a lifeguard at a pool in downtown Toronto, took a shortcut northbound through a park after getting off a Toronto Transit bus at Leslie St. and Steeles Ave. E. Wednesday night, and that her killer followed her as she made her way through the woods.
A few days later, police issued an appeal seeking a suspect. Described as a white male in his early to mid-20s, about 5'8" to 5'11", with a fair complexion and well-groomed light-brown hair combed over his forehead, he was the only other passenger with Kundinger on the bus on Wednesday night, and they got off at the same stop at about 10:50 p.m.
A solid suspect was later arrested, a 34-year-old mental patient who had an unusual interest in the crime, but the case against him fell apart in 1977 when it was established he had been fed details of the crime by a former policeman."

subject change:
hope you're enjoying the summer and loved ones, D...cheers

[jj]

Originally Posted by jj

D, first, no updates really...just a bunch of satellite court appearances that seem to accomplish nothing other than setting next court date for each of the accused

ok, i was joking but it seems to be true!

here's an excerpt from today's paper where the headline had read Accused Makes Court Appearance...I clicked on the link immediately to see what was up:

"Terri-Lynne McClintic appeared in a Woodstock, Ont., court via a video link and a new court date was set for Oct. 1."


...for a more moving update (no pun intended), Tori's dad is Alberta Bound, cycling there to release her ashes from mountain top they once visited and raising money for Child Find in the process...that should close the book no this young life wasted by two likely wasted individuals...a sobering tale...Deb, if seeking updates, just type in 'Tori + Woodstock' in google about 6 months from now and maybe there will actually be some court news

[jj]

Originally Posted by brink-

Updates?

http://www.thestar.com/news/ontario/article/803271

deb, you may be the one who has to provide the updates to us...mums the word

[charlene]

this ban is wrong. period.
we'll see how it plays out in the next week or so.

[jj]

Originally Posted by MistyMoppens

It makes my blood run cold to realize that this person is now a mother and is responsible for a vulnerable child.

i heard a rumour that one of the boys who was responsible for Jamie Bulger's horrifying last few hours of life, is now a father and has an entire life of freedom ahead of him...with a new ID of course, and perhaps plastic surgery...my blood boils

anyhow, there is enough worry some news in the world these past few weeks without my bringing these downer threads back to the forefront...apologies, but I agree with char...i got a headache trying to understand the ban strategy but it just seems wrong...maybe the did but a deal with Mclintic (i am empathetic that she had a sad, unwanted childhood but it's no excuse for not being able to tell right from wrong...make that, right from horrific)

[timetraveler]

I can't help but wonder myself, just exactly what sort of a demon possess's aperson & makes them do that sort of horrific thing.

[jj]

Originally Posted by charlene

it seems that the 18 year old girl knew tori's mum thru their common oxycontin drug use..

it amazes me that the father has been able to "mum" (pun intended) the truth about her involvement ...of course its all speculation and alleged at this point but 'the' motive has become clear to me...this poor kid was put in harm's way, imo...the truth will be told...i don't know how some people sleep at night

update, Deb: the pre-trial of Rafferty (the fella who owned the car...never did find that car seat) starts today

[charlene]

Tori's parents failed her before she ever was abducted...
It's hard to see the TV coverage and read the re-caps of the case over again..

[jj]

"we are incredible parents"

Police, family criticize rumours - YouTube

i remember this quote

lady, the drug debts were part of the clues.... and it was $400, not $600... but who's counting

also recall the quote where she said she never saw McClintic in her life

she had her 15 minutes of fame, everyday, years ago... now she gets her 15 minutes of humility

well, in other news...i like this lady

http://www.thestar.com/news/article/...abduction?bn=1

[charlene]

I remember too...everybody does and she's got to be having a hard time looking herself in the mirror.

thankfully the woman in the video did something to help the boy. if only Tori had been sending signals to those who saw her leaving with that monster she possibly could have been saved.

[jj]

the trials are finally over....quite historic for parents from this prov/country

the monstrous couple have both gone away for LIFE now...Rafferty got 10 more to be served concurrently for the sexual assault and kidnap as well

an hour ago, he actually admitted that he had done many crimes and was sorry

quite a thorough video compilation here of scenes from the past 3 years

http://www.lfpress.com/video/tori’s-story/1638725409001

i think the McClintic mother (holy smokes!) Rafferty mother should do lunch

[jj]

oh, but it sounds like he stills thinks he's not guilty of these charges

i will look forward to hearing the missing pieces of the puzzle...why didn't he say so and take the stand when he had the chance...we wasted 3 years waiting (and probably $3M dollars as well!)


Raveena Aulakh
Staff Reporter

LONDON, ONT. — A tearful Michael Rafferty told Tori Stafford’s family that he is “very, very sorry” for what happened to their little girl but reiterated that he stands behind his plea of not guilty.

“I still disagree with the conviction on these three charges ... I am guilty of many crimes and many things I am very, very ashamed of,” said Rafferty.

“I am truly sorry to all the family... not that has any bearing coming from my mouth.”

Rafferty took most of those present in the courtroom by shock when Justice Thomas Heeney asked him if he had anything to say and Rafferty stood up and said yes. He then addressed Tara McDonald, Tori’s mother directly and said: “Nobody has all the pieces of the puzzle and I am willing to give them.”

[charlene]

I can't imagine what that family has gone through...the pieces he speaks of should have been brought to the court while the tial was in process. he lost his chance. he can appeal but apparently may not. if i was an innocent person as he seems to be inferring he is, i would not be quietly trotting off to 25 years in the grey bar hotel in kingston ..