Bitter Green is in Open G Tuning!

[SGT]

I know there have to be SOME guitarists playing Gordon's songs out there. I have figured out the intro to Mountains of Maryann...finally. And now I have sussed Bitter Green! I started by playing the chords from the many versions on the web, including the ones from Wayne Francis page. Though musically correct, it is NOT what Gordon plays on the recording (BHOE). If you are interested, tune your guitar to DGDGBD, and put a capo on the 5th fret. If you play the shape of what WOULD be an am7 in standard tuning, you have the exact opening chord Gordon plays.

If anyone is interested in any of the things I'm doing to figure out "how GL played it on the recordings," let me know. I can maybe post mp3s of certain passages and/or chord descriptions (haven't learned how to do tab yet).

Ken

[Ken Theriot]

I know there have to be SOME guitarists playing Gordon's songs out there. I have figured out the intro to Mountains of Maryann...finally. And now I have sussed Bitter Green! I started by playing the chords from the many versions on the web, including the ones from Wayne Francis page. Though musically correct, it is NOT what Gordon plays on the recording (BHOE). If you are interested, tune your guitar to DGDGBD, and put a capo on the 5th fret. If you play the shape of what WOULD be an am7 in standard tuning, you have the exact opening chord Gordon plays.

If anyone is interested in any of the things I'm doing to figure out "how GL played it on the recordings," let me know. I can maybe post mp3s of certain passages and/or chord descriptions (haven't learned how to do tab yet).

Ken

[Cathy]

Ken, as far as I know, the only alternate tuning Gord uses is Dropped D. I've watched him play Bitter Green many times, and it's definitely in standard tuning.
I don't get too caught up in playing exactly like Gord. For one thing, my picking style, especially Travis, is a bit different. He mostly uses alternating thumb and two fingers, and I use three fingers on many songs. And sometimes I try to mix in a little lead, even if it's not exactly the same, because I usually play solo, and it just makes the songs more interesting.

[vlmagee]

Ken, the chords on Wayne's site are almost always exactly what was in the original songbook (where there was a songbook, of course). In many cases the songbook is not 100% faithful to Gord's exact chords, and that is where the differences creep in, where Gord is playing a chord varient which the sheetmusic writer didn't know (usually someone else, not the songwriter, writes the music notation for these songbooks). For the 3 songbooks and one additional song where there are photocopies of Gord's original leadsheets, I would say that you can rely on the songbook, but beyond that you have to trust your ears. BHOE was not one of the precious three that included leadsheets (the one additional song is CRT).

As Cathy says, Gord - at least today - uses only standard tuning and dropped D. Whether he ever tuned to something else when he played live, I can't say, but from those three songbooks (SSOL, DQ and ODR), I'd guess that at least by the early 1970s he wasn't using any other tunings.

He did move the capo pretty freely in the early days, with it on the 1st, 2nd or 3rd fret on various songs. Today, he moves it only once, at the end of the show, when he plays either ODR or COTS (2nd to 3rd fret). For dropped D, 3rd fret, on the 12 string, he has used a second guitar for many years. He has commented frequently that he doesn't like to move the capo, because it can put the guitar out of tune (and he doesn't like to retune on stage because of the time it takes plus he is very fussy), and he would NEVER move it more than once.

Anyhow, he definitely doesn't play Bitter Green with an alternate tuning today, and probably didn't originally. So if you want to play it like he does, you should start again with what is posted at Wayne's site or in the BHOE songbook if you have it (if not, somebody here can probably help you out). The songbook may have a notation about capo placement as well.

[ April 06, 2007, 14:07: Message edited by: vlmagee ]

[Ginny]

In the "Back Here On Earth" songbook on page 54 it shows "Bitter Green" in the drop "D" tuning with the capo on the second fret. The key would now be "E" and the song would be played in the "D" chord position. I use a "Shubb" capo on the second fret and cover all strings with the exception of the low "E" string. If I'm having a good voice day and the vocal chords are open wide I'll move it up to the the key of "F." In that case the Shubb will now be on the third fret and a second capo will be required to cover the low "E" string on the first fret. Kenyon (talented Lightfoot fan who comes to the Massey concerts) showed me how to play the intro the way Gord does it on the recording so from there I just carry it on in the "Travis" style with as much of the "drop D drone" as I can get. If you can make it to the next Massey gig there will be many things that can se shared on the guitar with the talented group that usually comes to those gigs. It's a beautiful song and one time when I was playing it a lady came up to me and said she was a friend of Gord's late ex wife Brita and that he wrote that song for her. Ron Jones.

[SGT]

Guys,

I figured out it wasn't in an alternate tuning like 15 minutes after I posted my message. I immediately posted a follow-up with the REAL chords. The recording from BHOE was capo 3 with the chord voicings I posted in my 2 follow-ups.

My only point is that for the last 25 years, I've frequently seen the guitar chords published be OK if you only want to approximate the accompaniment. But many, many, many times (especially with Dan Fogelberg, Jim Croce and Stan Rogers, what the ACTUALLY play is different. And geeks like me want to play it exactly as it was recorded. I was just hoping to get a discussion goin with other guitarists to compare versions. I still hope that. Did anyone see my post with the intro chords?

Ken

[Ken Theriot]

Guys,

I figured out it wasn't in an alternate tuning like 15 minutes after I posted my message. I immediately posted a follow-up with the REAL chords. The recording from BHOE was capo 3 with the chord voicings I posted in my 2 follow-ups.

My only point is that for the last 25 years, I've frequently seen the guitar chords published be OK if you only want to approximate the accompaniment. But many, many, many times (especially with Dan Fogelberg, Jim Croce and Stan Rogers, what the ACTUALLY play is different. And geeks like me want to play it exactly as it was recorded. I was just hoping to get a discussion goin with other guitarists to compare versions. I still hope that. Did anyone see my post with the intro chords?

Ken

[Paul Farnham]

Could someone please post a link to Wayne's site? Thanks!

[charlene]

Originally posted by Paul Farnham:
Could someone please post a link to Wayne's site? Thanks!

www.lightfoot.ca

[charlene]

Originally posted by Paul Farnham:
Could someone please post a link to Wayne's site? Thanks!

www.lightfoot.ca