Gordon Lightfoot Forums - question about The Gypsy

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i've been giving this song some thought lately, and I wonder, when Gord says "A little knowledge serves you well but the golden rule does not", what exactly is 'The golden rule'?

Also, what was he talking about when he said "The more we learn, the worse we get"? I've always thought he was talking about politics, but it's only a guess... :confused:

Quote:

Originally posted by Highwayman:
what exactly is 'The golden rule'?

Also, what was he talking about when he said "The more we learn, the worse we get"?

Hi Highwayman

Both very good questions I might say but then I might also say that the answer to both
is
"diddlededum deedledee"
as in
"She said, deedlee-dum, deedlee-dee
You are so old, you are so wise
Deedlee-dum, deedlee-dy
Give me a sign, tell it to me"
John Fowles
Gordon was obviously most impressed with the concept of "golden legislation" as he also wrote
Two of us could not be wrong;
Heaven knows who keeps the golden rule?
But then Sister Sledge also got in on the act as per their song "we are family" on the full monty soundtrack
from:-
http://www.stlyrics.com/lyrics/thefu...earefamily.htm
(WE!) no we don't get depressed
Here's what we call our golden rule
Have faith in you and the things you do
You won't go wrong
This is our family Jewel
Edited Monday September 26th to add further results fom Google searching

[ September 26, 2005, 10:36: Message edited by: johnfowles ]

Quote:

Originally posted by Highwayman:
what exactly is 'The golden rule'?

Also, what was he talking about when he said "The more we learn, the worse we get"?

Hi, Highwayman. The "Golden Rule" is "Do unto others what you would have them do unto you"--that is, treat other people the way you would like to be treated. When I'm in a certain mood, I love this cynical song--"A little knowledge serves you well, but the golden rule does not" and "The more we learn the worse we get" seem to say that as we as individuals and as a society "advance", the more we get away from our innocence, trusting and compassion for each other and the more we twist our knowledge to our own selfish ends. That's my read on it, but I didn't write the song--you'd have to ask the source.
DQ

First of all I should start with an apology as this posting is straying rather from the subject matter of Gordon but it does finish with a reference to Toronto.
Talking about the golden rule reminded me how taken I was when I first read as a maths student (yes in the UK we studied "maths" that being a more appropriate abbreviation for mathematics than the American "math") about the golden number that I now see is also known as the "The golden ratio",and/or also known as the divine proportion, golden mean, or golden section or by the symbol phi defined eloquently and mathematically on:-
http://mathworld.wolfram.com/GoldenRatio.html
where it states that " It is also a so-called Pisot Number"
(don't tell me to pis. o..!!)
But to put it simply in the manner I first heard of it if you have a rectangle whose sides are that ratio then mark off a square at one end the remaining rectangle's sides are in the exact same ratio as the original rectangle's and so on ad infinitum
"successive points dividing a golden rectangle into squares lie on a logarithmic spiral. This figure is known as a whirling square."
These diagrams might help you get your tonsils around the concept
http://mathworld.wolfram.com/images/...Ratio_1401.gif

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...ratio_line.png
A rather more direct definition and explanation is at:-
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_ratio
"The golden ratio is an irrational number, approximately 1.61803..., that possesses many interesting properties. Shapes defined by the golden ratio have long been considered aesthetically pleasing in Western cultures, reflecting nature's balance between symmetry and asymmetry and the ancient Pythagorean belief that reality is a numerical reality, except that numbers were not units as we define them today, but were expressions of ratios. The golden ratio is still used frequently in art and design. The golden ratio is also referred to as the golden mean, golden section, golden number, divine proportion or sectio divina."
The value of this ratio can of course be computed
as wikipedia says:
The golden ratio value http://en.wikipedia.org/math/2e939a5...1fe60be222.png is the only positive number that is exactly 1 less than its own square.
Note the reference above to "aesthetically pleasing"
and the value 1.61803
Actual examples of the occurrence of this ratio are listed on:-
http://www.php-deluxe.net/wiwimod,in...lden-ratio.htm
and include:-
"Credit cards are generally 3 3/8 by 2 1/8 inches in size, which is less than 2 percent from the golden ratio."
"The Acropolis, including the Parthenon, is often claimed to have been constructed using the golden ratio."
"It is also claimed that the human body has proportions close to the golden ratio"
The number even has its own website
http://www.goldennumber.net/
where you can read amongst a plethora of items:-
Including the main example I remember
Nature (Life)
"The spiral growth of sea shells provide a simple,
but beautiful, example . . ."
A real logarithmic spiral
http://www.goldennumber.net/images/seashell.gif
Architecture
"Its use started as early as with the Egyptians in the design of the pyramids:"
and the architects "used it in the design of Notre Dame in Paris"
In our time
"Its use continues in modern architecture, as illustrated in the United Nations building"
and even:-
"The CN Tower in Toronto, the tallest tower and freestanding structure in the world,contains the golden ratio in its design. The ratio of observation deck at 342 meters to the total height of 553.33 is 0.618 or phi, the reciprocal of Phi!"
http://www.goldennumber.net/images/cntower.gif
However for a long time I have had in my mind the misconception that this ratio is in fact close to the 4:3 common television screen and digital camera pictures dimensions but obviously that is incorect
John Fowles
Here endeth today's art. history and mathematics lessons boys and girls
Class dismissed
"wake up at the back there" Steve

[ September 27, 2005, 11:21: Message edited by: johnfowles ]

i think Don's take on the song is right on the $$! :)

As for what the golden rule is,it's the rule I've lived by all my life,"Do Unto Others As You Would Have Them Do Unto You." ..and I do. ;)

Fascinating John. A golden ratio post indeed.
Spookily, the golden ratio 's tentacles reach even further. There were also only 1.61803 people out of 10 who could make the slightest sense of your post!

Rumour has it that John is considering the merits of adding an additional feature to his posts . It is a Scratch N Sniff option and is a massive time saver. This innovation will enable the reader to confirm their suspicions regarding the content of John's posts simply by running a fingernail over the screen where his posts are situated.
My whiz bang PC already has this feature and I tried it out on John's post above.
Maybe they should add an "Air Freshener" feature as I have never smelt anything so reminiscent of cow poo emanating from a PC before....

[ September 28, 2005, 04:22: Message edited by: Sydney Steve ]

Quote:

Originally posted by Sydney Steve:
There were also only 1.61803 people out of 10 who could make the slightest sense of your post!
[/b]

Perhaps you should have tried harder young man
The trouble with Steve is that he is unrespectful of his elders and betters and lamentably unable to appreciate when somebody tries to make up for his woefully inadequate education not to mention his physical attributes
However I have found the perfect logo for him
http://www.johnfowles.org.uk/lightfoot/stevedunce.gif
John Fowles

[ September 28, 2005, 08:42: Message edited by: johnfowles ]

Quote:

Originally posted by Sydney Steve:
There were also only 1.61803 people out of 10 who could make the slightest sense of your post!
[/b]

Thanks for all the replies. i've always heard the phrase "do unto others as you would have them do unto you", but I've never heard it as 'the golden rule'. :)

Originally posted by Don Quixote

Quote:

"The more we learn the worse we get" seem to say that as we as individuals and as a society "advance", the more we get away from our innocence, trusting and compassion for each other and the more we twist our knowledge to our own selfish ends. That's my read on it, but I didn't write the song--you'd have to ask the source.

I think you hit the nail on the head with that one. :)

Thanks for all the replies. i've always heard the phrase "do unto others as you would have them do unto you", but I've never heard it as 'the golden rule'. :)

Originally posted by Don Quixote

Quote:

I think you hit the nail on the head with that one. :)