Is there anyone else who agrees that Gord is probably one of the best and most original singers around?

Is there anyone else who agrees that Gord is probably one of the best and most original singers around?

Gee, let me give that a neo second to think
ok I thought about it.
Amen to that brother

Gee, let me give that a neo second to think
ok I thought about it.
Amen to that brother

Ditto!

I thought about it and you may be right. http://www.corfid.com/ubb/smile.gif

Bill

Lightfoot may be one of the finest singer/songwriters, but it's hard to top Lennon/McCartney in their prime. They are what I would describe as "the best."

Lightfoot may be one of the finest singer/songwriters, but it's hard to top Lennon/McCartney in their prime. They are what I would describe as "the best."

I would still have to say Gordon. Are you taking about there early 60's work when they where the mob top or there later six's work.
The beatles are a differnt type of music then Gordon's. Both good in there own way but hads down for Gordon
lightbunny

I would still have to say Gordon. Are you taking about there early 60's work when they where the mob top or there later six's work.
The beatles are a differnt type of music then Gordon's. Both good in there own way but hads down for Gordon
lightbunny

Lightbunny,
Lennon/McCartney earn my vote all the way from Please Please Me to Long and Winding Road. (Their solo work is more sporadic, in quality, and I have to ignore the drugs and Lennon's politics...but musically they're hard to outshine.) By the way, what is a "light bunny"?

Lightbunny,
Lennon/McCartney earn my vote all the way from Please Please Me to Long and Winding Road. (Their solo work is more sporadic, in quality, and I have to ignore the drugs and Lennon's politics...but musically they're hard to outshine.) By the way, what is a "light bunny"?

are we talking singer or songwriter?. if it's songwriter, it has to be Bob Dylan. If it's singer, forget dylan for a moment http://www.corfid.com/ubb/smile.gif

Personally, GL is my favorite singer/songwriter. His music has always touched me; it seems effortless, as if these songs have always existed, and he is simply uncovering them. Michaelangelo said his statues were in the block of stone, he just had to chip away the outside. Am I off base in believing that GL is the same sort of "natural" artist? Objectively, I would say the Dylan is the greatest singer/songwriter, but we all have preferences. Mine happens to be Gordon Lightfoot.

HE INDEED IS ONE OF THE BEST, IM NOT SURE IM ONLY GUESSING BUT IF JAMES TAYLOR, NEAL DIANMOND, CARLY SIMON, JIM CROCE WERE SINGER/SONGWRITERS THEN THEY ARE SOME OF MY OTHER FAVORITES.

HE INDEED IS ONE OF THE BEST, IM NOT SURE IM ONLY GUESSING BUT IF JAMES TAYLOR, NEAL DIANMOND, CARLY SIMON, JIM CROCE WERE SINGER/SONGWRITERS THEN THEY ARE SOME OF MY OTHER FAVORITES.

IMO Gordon Lightfoot is MOST certainly one
of the best - and very near the top of the
list. Again IMO he completely outwrites and out sings The Beatles and several of the
others mentioned so far. But it is all about
preferences.

Well he is my favorite too! That is not to take anything away from Bob Dylan, Lennon/McCartney, Michael Nesmith, John Prine, Kris Kristofferson, Norman Blake et al. But to answer the question: Yeah, Gord is the best!

Well he is my favorite too! That is not to take anything away from Bob Dylan, Lennon/McCartney, Michael Nesmith, John Prine, Kris Kristofferson, Norman Blake et al. But to answer the question: Yeah, Gord is the best!

Hmmm...in terms of songwriting, this is always sort of a tough one. As some people have alluded to, there is a subtle difference between who is one's favorite, and who is "the best." Yes, Gordon Lightfoot is my personal favorite: his songs are the ones that speak the clearest to my heart, soul and mind. But if I take a step back and try to be dispassionate about it, then the field becomes a bit wider. I probably would rank Lennon/McCartney's work with the Beatles (as individual and collective composers) at the top of the list of popular songwriters. It's easy to say something like "I Want to Hold Your Hand" is just a cute, early 60s pop song, but you have to keep in mind just how revolutionary that song was in terms of its melodic and harmonic components. They basically broke new ground with every album, but it's their sheer progression that always amazes me. To go from something like "Please Please Me" to "Strawberry Fields" in four years is remarkable. Dylan would have to rank right up there too, although he's not a personal favorite of mine. His songs may not speak to me, but I recognize his importance. If I take that dispassionate step back and look at GL, I rank him up there with the great songwriters, but not at the top. I don't consider him a groundbreaker or anything like that. However, in the context of what he does, he is a supremely skilled craftsman--I love the way he constructs his songs, and the chord movements...there is an inescapable logic to everything he does. And as an artist, as a lyricist, he is top-notch. My GL "epiphany" song was Don Quixote--when I first heard it back in '72, I thought I had never heard anyone marry such a simple and yet exquisite melody with such meaningful, deep and beautiful lyrics. He shot to number one in my personal pantheon of singer/songwriters.

And lo and behond, he's still there! http://www.corfid.com/ubb/smile.gif
Derek

Hmmm...in terms of songwriting, this is always sort of a tough one. As some people have alluded to, there is a subtle difference between who is one's favorite, and who is "the best." Yes, Gordon Lightfoot is my personal favorite: his songs are the ones that speak the clearest to my heart, soul and mind. But if I take a step back and try to be dispassionate about it, then the field becomes a bit wider. I probably would rank Lennon/McCartney's work with the Beatles (as individual and collective composers) at the top of the list of popular songwriters. It's easy to say something like "I Want to Hold Your Hand" is just a cute, early 60s pop song, but you have to keep in mind just how revolutionary that song was in terms of its melodic and harmonic components. They basically broke new ground with every album, but it's their sheer progression that always amazes me. To go from something like "Please Please Me" to "Strawberry Fields" in four years is remarkable. Dylan would have to rank right up there too, although he's not a personal favorite of mine. His songs may not speak to me, but I recognize his importance. If I take that dispassionate step back and look at GL, I rank him up there with the great songwriters, but not at the top. I don't consider him a groundbreaker or anything like that. However, in the context of what he does, he is a supremely skilled craftsman--I love the way he constructs his songs, and the chord movements...there is an inescapable logic to everything he does. And as an artist, as a lyricist, he is top-notch. My GL "epiphany" song was Don Quixote--when I first heard it back in '72, I thought I had never heard anyone marry such a simple and yet exquisite melody with such meaningful, deep and beautiful lyrics. He shot to number one in my personal pantheon of singer/songwriters.

And lo and behond, he's still there! http://www.corfid.com/ubb/smile.gif
Derek

For singer, there are quite a few who top Gord, as I'm sure he'd admit. Elvis and Sinatra, to name but two. Not that the young Gord didn't have a beautiful voice.

For songwriter (NOT including Bach, Beethoven and their ilk), he's behind very few in this century. I personally like him better than Dylan as a songwriter, although he was not as influential. You'd have to consider that the top tier of popular songwriters of this century would include Dylan, Irving Berlin, Woody Guthrie, Rodgers & Hammerstein, Lennon/McCartney and Paul Simon as top songwriters. I'd put them all ahead of Gord. I think Duke Ellington, Andrew Lloyn Webber, and Bruce Springsteen belong in Gord's class too (you HAVE to hear Springsteen's new album, an incredibly mature and moving response to Sept 11).

As for singer/songwriters, I'd take Lennon/McCartney as tops, a clear level above the others. A nudge behind them, I'd put Gord. I'd also include Paul simon, Joni Mitchell, Billy Joel and Elton John in his tier.

So I don't think Gord is the "best ever." HOWEVER, he is the only one currently writing in his genre, the songs of the sea, of the land and of the wanderer. The songs of break-up, of sorrow and of surprising joy and beauty. Those of us who LOVE that genre, find Gord to be incomparable.

Count me as one of those.


------------------
"And the laughter came too easy for life to pass me by."

For singer, there are quite a few who top Gord, as I'm sure he'd admit. Elvis and Sinatra, to name but two. Not that the young Gord didn't have a beautiful voice.

For songwriter (NOT including Bach, Beethoven and their ilk), he's behind very few in this century. I personally like him better than Dylan as a songwriter, although he was not as influential. You'd have to consider that the top tier of popular songwriters of this century would include Dylan, Irving Berlin, Woody Guthrie, Rodgers & Hammerstein, Lennon/McCartney and Paul Simon as top songwriters. I'd put them all ahead of Gord. I think Duke Ellington, Andrew Lloyn Webber, and Bruce Springsteen belong in Gord's class too (you HAVE to hear Springsteen's new album, an incredibly mature and moving response to Sept 11).

As for singer/songwriters, I'd take Lennon/McCartney as tops, a clear level above the others. A nudge behind them, I'd put Gord. I'd also include Paul simon, Joni Mitchell, Billy Joel and Elton John in his tier.

So I don't think Gord is the "best ever." HOWEVER, he is the only one currently writing in his genre, the songs of the sea, of the land and of the wanderer. The songs of break-up, of sorrow and of surprising joy and beauty. Those of us who LOVE that genre, find Gord to be incomparable.

Count me as one of those.


------------------
"And the laughter came too easy for life to pass me by."

I didn't see Derek's reply as I was writing mine (above).

I agree with everything he said.

I didn't see Derek's reply as I was writing mine (above).

I agree with everything he said.

quote:Originally posted by 2Much2Lose:
I didn't see Derek's reply as I was writing mine (above).

I agree with everything he said.



But...but...I agree with everything YOU said! Dang...this is getting awfully confusing! http://www.corfid.com/ubb/smile.gif
Derek

quote:Originally posted by 2Much2Lose:
I didn't see Derek's reply as I was writing mine (above).

I agree with everything he said.



But...but...I agree with everything YOU said! Dang...this is getting awfully confusing! http://www.corfid.com/ubb/smile.gif
Derek

Several excellent points have been made. When I say "Gord is the best" I am speaking for myself with a bit of bias. A better statement would be: "No one is better than Gordon." I could say the same thing about several songwriters. To pick out the "best" is a fruitless pursuit. Each artist is an individual with no one else like them. This makes music interesting. I think we are very blessed to have so many fine singer/songwriters to listen to.

Several excellent points have been made. When I say "Gord is the best" I am speaking for myself with a bit of bias. A better statement would be: "No one is better than Gordon." I could say the same thing about several songwriters. To pick out the "best" is a fruitless pursuit. Each artist is an individual with no one else like them. This makes music interesting. I think we are very blessed to have so many fine singer/songwriters to listen to.

I don't think it's fair or correct to use an individual's personal preferences as the measure of an artist's greatness. So the issue of whether or not the Watchman likes the Beatles, while relevant to his personal choices, is not relevant to a measure of the greatness of an artist. Similarly, our love for Gord and his music speaks to a different issue than the issue of greatness.

I think there are several characteristics of greatness. Among them are universality, influence, timelessness and craft (skill). I believe that Gord's music is timeless, that it still will be appreciated hundreds of years from now. I know that he is a craftsman. He falls short on the scale of influence and the scale of universiality (with minor exceptions). Few of his songs address universal themes (with exceptions such as Beautiful).

I am sure that the Beatles' music is timeless and extremely influential, and not just to rock'n rollers. Their songs are the new standards of our age, interpreted and covered by jazz and classical artists, as well as rock. Moreover, the Beatles' music, films and off-screen behavior had an impact on society in the '60s. Their craftsmanship is superb and extremely complex and the songs, especially the later ones, address universal themes, such as the transcendence of love and the disconnectedness of modern life.

Although popularity cannot be the sole measure of greatness (consider the lack of popularity of the Iliad and Odyssey today), it is another factor to be considered. Most adults (over 21) would be hard-pressed to name more than one or two Gord songs, if that many. I'd wager that most adults could name at least 10 or more Beatles songs or Elvis songs. Until recently, "Yesterday" was the most played song on the radio in history (Unchained Melody has passed it). Similarly, if one measures the number of songs "covered" by other artists, the Beatles' music has a vast lead over anyone else.

Just as a matter of curiosity, I'd love to know how many Beatles' songs that Watchman can name, even though (1) he is not a fan, (2) he grew up after Lennon was already dead and (3) grew up more than a decade after the Beatles broke up.

(Since (1), (2) and (3) don't apply to me, I can tell you that I can name well over 100 songs by the Beatles, either as individuals or as a group. But I could also do that with Gord. LOL)



------------------
"And the laughter came too easy for life to pass me by."

I don't think it's fair or correct to use an individual's personal preferences as the measure of an artist's greatness. So the issue of whether or not the Watchman likes the Beatles, while relevant to his personal choices, is not relevant to a measure of the greatness of an artist. Similarly, our love for Gord and his music speaks to a different issue than the issue of greatness.

I think there are several characteristics of greatness. Among them are universality, influence, timelessness and craft (skill). I believe that Gord's music is timeless, that it still will be appreciated hundreds of years from now. I know that he is a craftsman. He falls short on the scale of influence and the scale of universiality (with minor exceptions). Few of his songs address universal themes (with exceptions such as Beautiful).

I am sure that the Beatles' music is timeless and extremely influential, and not just to rock'n rollers. Their songs are the new standards of our age, interpreted and covered by jazz and classical artists, as well as rock. Moreover, the Beatles' music, films and off-screen behavior had an impact on society in the '60s. Their craftsmanship is superb and extremely complex and the songs, especially the later ones, address universal themes, such as the transcendence of love and the disconnectedness of modern life.

Although popularity cannot be the sole measure of greatness (consider the lack of popularity of the Iliad and Odyssey today), it is another factor to be considered. Most adults (over 21) would be hard-pressed to name more than one or two Gord songs, if that many. I'd wager that most adults could name at least 10 or more Beatles songs or Elvis songs. Until recently, "Yesterday" was the most played song on the radio in history (Unchained Melody has passed it). Similarly, if one measures the number of songs "covered" by other artists, the Beatles' music has a vast lead over anyone else.

Just as a matter of curiosity, I'd love to know how many Beatles' songs that Watchman can name, even though (1) he is not a fan, (2) he grew up after Lennon was already dead and (3) grew up more than a decade after the Beatles broke up.

(Since (1), (2) and (3) don't apply to me, I can tell you that I can name well over 100 songs by the Beatles, either as individuals or as a group. But I could also do that with Gord. LOL)



------------------
"And the laughter came too easy for life to pass me by."

I'm a Brit and I do not rever the Beatles.
I can name a few of their songs but not many.
Most of them I find boring or nonsensical.
I have never understood their 'greatness'.
Personal preferences must have something to do with what is considered to be 'Great'.
If nobody had listened to the Beatles, bought
their records, etc. Would they not have
disappeared into the mists of the 1960s
never to be heard of again? Would they then
have been considered such great songwriters?
Personal preferences of their hysterical fans
at that time made them icons and so they
entered the realms of 'Greatness'. But this
is just my personal opinion. What the heck
do I know other than for me Gordon Lightfoot
is the best! http://www.corfid.com/ubb/smile.gif

Well I have to say Gordon is my favorite singer songwriter. His music is the background for my life in a lot of ways. I also like his voice. It has a haunting yet romantic sound. My other favorites are John Haitt, John Prine, Jimmy Buffett, Steve Earle, Nanci Griffith, bob Dylan. Neil Young, Kate Wolf, and Stan Rogers. All unique in there own ways. I know have 8,478 cd'since
salute and shadows.

This is a great thread BUT I just need to verify one point. paddletothesea: did you say 8,478 cds? As in: eight thousand four hundred and seventy eight? Really? That's very cool!

Bill

i'm a big fan of a lot of people, but i get a bit annoyed at the lack of appreciation of Gordon's work. with the ever increasing amount of c.d.'s that get poured into stores weekly, & as the age of music buyers gets younger, it's obvious that people's tastes are turning elsewhere. what really bothers me is there are too many folks my age that don't care if Gord ever releases another album. for example, why was Massey Hall filled every night during the "Shadows" tour, but the album died virtually stillborn?
the answer is people just want to hear the hits. (except of course, the true Lightheads).
i've strayed a bit from the orig. topic, but the bottom line is this: Lennon & McCartney could never have written "Seven Island Suite" while Gordon could never have written "Let it Be".
i'm just glad that "7 Island..." got a mention. truly a wonderful song!

[QUOTE]Originally posted by TheWatchman:

Personal opinions are exactly how you measure an artist. This is how you measure popularity as well as influence.


This is a big difference between art and science. Measurement in Science is quantitative, In art it's qualitative. The fact that Helium is an inert gas is not a matter of opinion, nor is it inert because that's the way it touched someone's heart. It's a result of analysis of the properties of Helium. Therefore,it is the safest gas to use in a blimp. Somebody stating why a particular artist is better than another can only be based on their opinion and feelings. (So, "Gordon Lightfoot is the best singer/songwriter ever because he is lighter than air and non-combustible" is probably an opinion).

Watchman,
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I suspect that the only Beatles songs you've ever heard are those which receive radio airplay. Though many Beatles tracks do get airplay, obviously most don't, so what you hear on the radio cannot fairly represent the extent of their output. I bet you'd be ASTONISHED if you were to listen to the entire Help! album, the entire Rubber Soul album, the entire White album, the entire Abbey Road album, etc. Beatles discs are supersaturated with tremendous tunes. While it may be true that "I Want To Hold Your Hand" is, as you say, "simple music," this misses the point. As previously stated, what most impresses is the prolificness and rapid growth of the Beatles: 13 albums in only seven or eight years, FROM "I Want To Hold Your Hand" all the unbelievable way TO "A Day In The Life" (and beyond). I love the music of Gordon Lightfoot, but consider this: Lightfoot can write well in perhaps one or two "styles" or "genres" of music, but the Beatles were talented with pretty much EVERY possible style (rock, pop, blues, folk, metal, broadway and whatever I've left out). No exaggeration.

Watchman,
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I suspect that the only Beatles songs you've ever heard are those which receive radio airplay. Though many Beatles tracks do get airplay, obviously most don't, so what you hear on the radio cannot fairly represent the extent of their output. I bet you'd be ASTONISHED if you were to listen to the entire Help! album, the entire Rubber Soul album, the entire White album, the entire Abbey Road album, etc. Beatles discs are supersaturated with tremendous tunes. While it may be true that "I Want To Hold Your Hand" is, as you say, "simple music," this misses the point. As previously stated, what most impresses is the prolificness and rapid growth of the Beatles: 13 albums in only seven or eight years, FROM "I Want To Hold Your Hand" all the unbelievable way TO "A Day In The Life" (and beyond). I love the music of Gordon Lightfoot, but consider this: Lightfoot can write well in perhaps one or two "styles" or "genres" of music, but the Beatles were talented with pretty much EVERY possible style (rock, pop, blues, folk, metal, broadway and whatever I've left out). No exaggeration.

For whatever it's worth, Watchman... Try the Beatles' Rubber Soul for their most catchy tunes, most consistent sound, most tight bandlike effort. Try the White album for the Beatles' on their way to breaking apart but admirably tackling every imaginable musical style. (Again, the wonder is not most product in least time; it is the accelerated musical growth, under the guidance of producer George Martin.) Much thanks for your opinions and replies.

For whatever it's worth, Watchman... Try the Beatles' Rubber Soul for their most catchy tunes, most consistent sound, most tight bandlike effort. Try the White album for the Beatles' on their way to breaking apart but admirably tackling every imaginable musical style. (Again, the wonder is not most product in least time; it is the accelerated musical growth, under the guidance of producer George Martin.) Much thanks for your opinions and replies.