quote:Originally posted by DB:
Sorry Clementine, but I have to disagree with you on that topic. When Red had left, Lightfoot had not had a chart topping hit. Yes Terry is a good guitar player, but it was Red's guitar that really embellished his recordings. It's really too bad that you had to miss Gordon's success and his best years, but if Terry is your cup of tea so be it. Sorry, "Terryites" but it's too bad that you became fans late in his career, and had to miss the Lightfoot that was.

DB, I don't know if you're trying to say that when Red left, Gord HADN'T YET had any chart topping hits, or that when he left, Gord NO LONGER had any hits. Either way, your assertion is incorrect. "If You Could Read My Mind" was recorded before Terry came aboard. The credits of "Sundown" list Terry playing acoustic and Red handling the electric guitar duties. "The Wreck of The Edmund Fitzgerald" was after Red's departure. So it appears that Red Shea and Terry Clements played on an equal number of hits. Not that I think how many hits one has or plays on, is really an accurate measure of one's talent or a song's worth. Gord had lots of great songs that weren't chart climbers, but I'm just addressing your point.
If you're saying that since Red was earlier, the only reason anyone could possibly prefer Terry, is if they became fans later in GL's career and didn't get a chance to hear Red's playing, that is not quite correct either. First of all, many fans of Terry's have been listening to Gord since Red was GL's one and only ax man. Secondly, quite a few of us who became GL followers later on, have nearly ALL of Gord's songs...from the UA years to Painter Passing Through. So we didn't miss either guitarist's recordings, as they last forever. Some of us just happen to love Terry's playing because his sound is unique, stirring, soulful and downright brilliant. Not that Red's isn't and I certainly don't want to sound like I am putting him down, far from it... but when I heard "Wreck", it was Terry's lead guitar that first captured my attention. The notes he pulls from that instrument seem to conjure up not only an aural, but a visual image of the events playing out in the song. He can take a meloncholy song like "Stone Cold Sober" and make it absolutley heart wrenching. His guitar sounds as if its almost weeping in sympathy with Gord's broken hearted lyrics. "Dream Street Rose" becomes infused a with sonic color when he adds his masterful touch to it. If you think Red is the bomb, fine..because he's certainly worthy of much praise. But to refer to Terry as merely a "good" guitar player is just an insult to an awesome talent. Terry isn't just good, he's fantasic. Many of us think he's all that and a bag of chips AND a snickers bar too!!
Erica(and a pint of Ben & Jerry's!)

Sundreme,

I was reading your statement, and I also have to DISAGREE with you,

Terry Clements is NOT like a snickers bar or a bag of potato chips, he is more like a "spare tire" when then the car has a flat. Yes he might have played on SOME of Gord's chart topping hits, but on most of them, and on some of the albums that are available on CD!!! but when you come to think of it, Red had played MORE different guitars on Lightfoot's recordings than Terry did!!! He played a Fender Stratocaster, a Fender Telecaster, A gut-string classical, a dobro, A Martin D-28, and a Martin D-35!!! Terry on the other hand ONLY played TWO guitars: A Martin D-18 and A Gretsch Country Gentleman. When Lightfoot was "Lightfoot" in those glory days, Clements' ONLY used the D-18. The Edmund Fitzgerald from 1976 was the ONLY chart topper and most successful hit that he used the Gretsch Country Gentleman on!!! The same thing applied to Summertime Dream. Red Shea plays in different ways: Fingerstyle: Using thumb and fingers, fingerpicks, flatpicks, and Travis style, like Gord's!!! He can also play using classical techniques, and in a Nashville Country style!!! Terry's style of playing is very limited he ONLY plays with a pick. He uses a capo, which Red very seldomly does!!! Gord has once said that he would NOT recommend others using the capo a lot. Red is NOT only a back up musician, he was also an arranger and a musical consultant for two albums: ENDLESS WIRE, and DREAM STREET ROSE. Terry just plays the guitar and that's just about it.

Hey Misty,
Well that's just about the nicest compliment you can give me. To say I resemble someone frilly hemline dress..anytime!! I would do just about anything for that sweet man, but that Terry adored so much is just wonderful! Thank you. Well, I don't know if I'd wear a wig, I kind of like my own hair..but a hopefully he'd appreciate me with my own locks. Instead of looking just like Patsy, We could tell him I'm her long lost daughter!! Although I was born after she passed on sadly, so maybe her niece. I just wish I could sing like the great Ms Cline!!
BTW, Don't forget to tell us why he sits on stage. I'm really curious. Have a great one!
Erica

Hey Misty,
That's weird. Even though I proof read my last post, it seems to have come out all garbled..Bizarre!! I really have to get around to registering so I can edit my messages.
Anyway, I was thanking you for sweet compliment you gave me when you said I resembled Patsy. I also said that its just one of the best compliments I could hear, to be told that I resemble someone that he adored so much.
I mentioned that I didn't know about wearing a wig, because I kind of like my own hair...I'd do anything for that sweet man, but he seems like the kind of person that appreciates people for themselves anyway...so hopefully he could put up with my long locks!! LOL, But a frilly dress...anytime! Instead of totally resembling her, we could tell him I'm her long lost daughter . But since she sadly passed away before I was born, maybe her neice. Just wish I could sing like her! Well, I think that pretty much clarifies what I was trying to say in my last post.
Its so funny, the way it came out, it looks like I was saying that I resembled a frilly hemline dress!! LOL
Oh, Kate, also like I said in the last post, dont forget to tell us why he sits on stage...!! Well, hopefully this post wont show up all garbled...Keeping my fingers crossed.
Erica

I have read DB's comparison between Red Shea and Terry Clements, and they sound accurate to me. DB sounds like a real criticizer (see what he wrote under withor without moustache) but he or she sure nailed the descriptions, and makes and models of the guitars that theses two pickers use right on the nose. Way to go DB!!!!

P/s Clements fans don't feel low, Terry is doing a brave thing filling in for Red Shea and I think that it takes courage andne r ve to do it so keep up the good work with keeping tradition Terry.

I have read DB's comparison between Red Shea and Terry Clements, and they sound accurate to me. DB sounds like a real criticizer (see what he wrote under withor without moustache) but he or she sure nailed the descriptions, and makes and models of the guitars that theses two pickers use right on the nose. Way to go DB!!!!

P/s Clements fans don't feel low, Terry is doing a brave thing filling in for Red Shea and I think that it takes courage andne r ve to do it so keep up the good work with keeping tradition Terry.

While visiting with Terry in San Diego I asked him why he sat while he played. He said that it was because he is taller than Gordon and that is what Gordon wants. Simple as that.
What a pleasure it was to meet him. He is very kind to his fans and certainly has a wonderful sense of humor.

He and Gordon get along so well, it is very apparent when they are together.

Erica,
I don't care what DB says. I bet if you put on your Patsy Cline dress (with or without the wig) and asked really nicely, Terry would be more than happy to give you guitar lessons. Give it a try! He coldn't possibly turn you down.
Again, with no malice whatsoever intended towards Red Shea, Terry probably has had far less free time on his hands than Red has for atn least the past 20 years. What time he has, he probably wants to spend with his family. It's understandable that he would not do any teaching.
I'm told that he had a really rough childhood. He's probably spent much of his adult life ensuring that his kids had a more pleasant and stable childhood than he had.
So what if he doesn't teach? He's still the greatest!

Hey Rebecca,

What's your gig? You mean you don't care what DB says? And You think Terry wll give her lesssons, and what's up with this Patsy Cline thing? This is a Gordon lightfoot website.So who cares about PatsyCline anyway. That DB loser knows more about guitars and guitarpicking styles than you'll ever know, so if you think TC is the "bomb" then why don't YOU get lessens form the man himself? This DB guy may be a losser but at least wise he probbly seen both of these two guitarists in action. Why don't you analyze Terry's guitar playing and compare it to Red? Why don't you get yourself a D18 or a Gretch Country Gentlemen and start studying Terry's guitarplaying? And play anywey? And who needs a wig to bribe Terry anyway? He likes your hair the way it is. So what if Terry's dreamgirl is Patsycline? I mean who cares? And who cares about why he sits down when he plays? Maybe he feels comfortable in that position. Different guitar players feel comfortable in different positions. Terry's just happens to be sitting down. You know something I found that most of the people who admire Terry's playing are GIRLS or LADIES if you may hoo don't paly guitar and the MEN or BOYS or tose woo paly guitar are RED fans. It's probbly because you girls are so dazzzled by Tery's looks and not hsi fingerings. You girls need a man, and one who is educated on guitars, so quit saying he's so fantastic and start notonly reading the credits and looking at the face and start llooking at his hands on the gutiar!!!!!

DB = Roy

Roy and/or DB,
I am not a guitarist. I'm a pianist. (Bachelor's and Matster's degrees in music performance, if you really need to know, which you don't). I know more than you'll ever need to know about piano techniques, but I don't claim to know much of anything about picking techniques. I don't really care how a guitarist achieves the sounds he gets; I'm merely interested in the results.
Terry's results sound every bit as professional and perfected as Red's, in my opinion.
I'm not going to ask Terry Clements or anyone else for guitar lessons because I don't even play the guitar. For that matter, I don't even own a guitar. Furthermore, I don't live close enough to Toronto, which is where he probably lives (I don't even KNOW that for sure; that's how much of a groupie I am) for it to be remotely practical.
As for the complaints about Patsy Cline . . . I'm not even sure who Patsy Cline is, but I'll make at least one reference to her in every post if I feel like doing so. Scroll past my posts if you find it offensive.
I'm married. Terry Clements is a nice-looking man, particularly for his age, but he's old enough to be my father.
I suspect that you're just trying to be funny and that your heart isn't really in all of your ridiculous assertions, but, adolescent pranks notwithstanding, you're becoming a bit of a boor. I respect your right to engage in boorish communication, though. I'll just scroll past your postings if reading them becomes too tiresome.
Rebecca

This is just a thought . . .
Have you ever wondered if people like Terry Clements ever visit this board. Major celebrities (Brad Pitt, Ben Affleck, and even Gordon Lightfoot) probably get so tired of reading about themselves that they avoid it whenever possible. The lesser known figures, however, might get a charge out of it. If you were Barry Keane or Heffernan or one of the others, wouldn't you check out sites just to see what people were saying about you? I would think they might get a good laugh out of what they read.
So, extending this line of thought one step further, is it possible that DB or Roy or whatever he's calling himself this hour really IS Terry Clements. Maybe he writes negative things about himself just so we'll all jump to his defense. Or maybe he just thinks it's funny.
It's hard to imagine that Terry Clements could be so obnoxious even on purpose, but who knows? Maybe he downs a couple of drinks and types whatever comes into his mind.
This is a stretch, I admit, but it's an interesting point to ponder.
Rebecca
P.S. Patsy Cline rules!!!! (whoever the hell she is)

I just want to add another 2 cents into the TC thread.
By the looks of it, people get the impression that Red was a better player and TC isn't as good but has the looks to make up for it?

Red might be more talented, but Terry sure sounds better. Although Red played some electric leads, the majority of his work is acoustic on Gords albums. The opposite is true for Terry.

I personally love that sound that terry came up with from EW throught to salute. ALthough, it may be simpler than Red's stuff, it sounds better. Isn't that the important thing?. When I was learning the guitar I was told to concentrate on the sound - not the amount of notes you can play per minute.

Verdict: Terry is a better lead guitarist. Since I'm a male, I'm not commenting on looks! (plus, the most recent picture of Red I've seen is on the GG vol 1 record). Anyone got any more recent pics of him?

I know I'm coming into this a little on the late side, but when Gord Playing Grand Junction CO., I got to spend ,most of my time after the concert with Terry. What a Joker!!! I told him how much I thought of his guitar work and he laughingly said, "Red taught me everything I know." As he was dying laughing about that, I causually added that, "It's been you for the last twenty-five years Terry, that's got to count for something." He stopped laughing then and took on an entirely different aire. Perhaps, it never occurred to him that he's been the one doing all the fancy work for the last 25 years and not Red. Not to take anything anyway from Mr. Shea. Gordon's been damn lucky to have had them both.

I would also like to add that, that it takes a true artist to take the music Gordon writes and then expand upon it to fill it out. A gift like that is rare....So is Terry.

How's that Erica?

Rob is right!!!! Red taught me everything I know!!! I would not have been a better guitar player if it were not for Red Shea.

I wonder if that's really Terry? :)

Anyway, at this point, I'd like to the DSR solo is one of the best I've ever heard :)

?

Dear Mr. Clements,
We are honored to have you post here. Please chime in any time you come across anything that needs clarification.


P.S. What is your birthday? What was the first album you did with Gord? What was your mother's maiden name?

My 2 cents worth -

I have not heard any other recording that reaches the energy of Red's CRT on Sunday Concert. Nor have I heard Terry reach (or even approach) that level on that song at any concert. Red may have a slight edge as a picker.

I have thought that some of Terry's concert performances were a little lackluster (perhaps a function of the low energy level of the band and the audience those nights), but others were quite outstanding.

That said, how can you possibly criticize Terry's overall work? His picking is superb, and the soul he puts into the more blues-y songs (e.g., Make Way for the Lady) is what elevates those songs to otherwise unreached (unreachable?) levels.

Bottom line? Couldn't you just listen to Terry for hours on end? Wouldn't that be heaven? What more can you ask from a musician?




------------------
"And the laughter came too easy for life to pass me by." - SDYS

By the way, MidniteM,

You didn't get that blue dress from a gal named Monica, did you? LOL

------------------
"And the laughter came too easy for life to pass me by." - SDYS

Realizing that anyone can post to this forum and use whatever name they choose, I would like to verify that the posts are really from T.C. There has been some questions raised as to this person's validity by their not knowing what DSR means. I do believe that the band doesn't use the abreviations and therefore they wouldn't know that it means Dream Street Rose. Ergo, it is not grounds for disputing this persons' identity.

So, to this Terry Clemments, I ask the following questions in hopes of eliminating any doubt for the rest of those who frequent this site. If you wouldn't mind Terry.

1. What was your first duty assignment in the Navy?

2. What occurred to facilitate your early release from the Navy?

3. What was it that I kept bugging you for in Grand Junction Colorado in August, because I left mine in the car?

4. Do you smoke and if yes, what?

5. What happened in Pheonix that put you under the weather for the next two concerts and how did it happen?

I know these answers and I know the real Terry does to. We spent a good hour together after the concert and shared some pretty personal stuff.

Call this the acid test.

Rob

It doesn't look like he is going to answer. Terry has been on the road with Gord, and is too busy to surf websites.

Just looking at the acid test questions (which even if TC sees, probabaly won't answer), I was wondering does Gord still smoke or has he given up?. I noticed that my voice sounds similar to his when I'm (trying) to sing & play one of his songs after a few smokes :)

You guys, I hate to burst everyone's bubble here, but the real reason that wasn't the real Terry Clements is because there is NO ONE in the EMP coalition that will even so much as TOUCH a computer. There are two computers in the EMP office and they don't even so much as turn them on. Terry, Rick, Mike, Barry and Barry Harvey (not to mention Gord) will have nothing whatsoever to do with computers. There is NO way in heck they would be surfing the net or checking out this site as nice as it is. The only person in the Lightfoot family that owns a computer is Eric and he has a Mac. That's the extent of it. So don't get all worried about what has been posted here by what I and everyone else thinks is an imposter.

PeeWee has a website, but I have not seen his name in this thread. He has written to a friend of mine. But don't you guys think for a second that if the REAL Terry Clements had posted here that PeeWee wouldn't have stepped in and made a comment?

I think we have all been had.

Stay loose, eh?

LAMS

------------------
"Love and maple syrup
go together like the
sticky winds of winter
when they meet....
If you go into the forest
Gaze up through the trees
The sky is white.
You can understand
What makes the forest
Greet the man
Like a mother's only
child ..."

Maybe Terry borrowed PeeWee's computer, but I am still very doubtful that you are likely to talk to any of the stars on this discussion forum. By the way, I think Gord still smokes but he is trying to quit. He doesn't drink anymore I don't think. If you want to talk to any of the band members including Gordon or Terry, ask Wayne Francis on his website for their email addresses. I am very doubtful you'll get them, because they are very private people. Musicians like their privacy, and like to keep busy, and if stars or their band members have emailing address, it will probably be clogged or loaded with messages. I personally don't know if it was the real TC or not, if not, then it was probably some jerk from the "Shea Alliance", perhaps the mysterious DB or the supportive Roy trying to get some of us excited. I am not on Terry's or Red's side. I think that both of them are equally talented guitarists, and they play beautifully together. Songs like Bend In The Water and The List show this wonderful winning team of guitarists complementing each other and sharing the role. I like it when they play together.

I was checking out Lightfoot's CD Catalogues from both past and present. It seems to me that the Red fans are happier that most of the CD's he played on are still available on CD except for Old Dan's Records. Since Terry fans are... well (gulp) so-so. A lot of the albums he played acoustic guitar on are available on CD. The final four, by which he played on "all" were and probably are still not available. I guess that DB or Roy guy who has been bugging all of you must have good taste in CDs. Unfortunately for you who are trying to ignore him, some of you love Terry's work on Dream Street Rose, and it's not been available on CD for a long, long much too long time, which has been so sad. Another CD which he played on "Waiting For You" is also sadly deleted and out of print. This is also a must-have for Lightfoot fans in the TC Camp. But on the good side, one of the best albums that shows Terry's best electric efforts "Summertime Dream" is still available, and you can hear him do fantastic soloing on The Wreck Of Edmund Fitzgerald, and I Do It Again: The best lead he's ever done. This is also an essential must have for TC fans!!! But however the final four and Waiting For You are made up for by the Songbook Boxset, and feature some pictures of Terry during younger days!!! If you're a Terry fan looking forward to the final four, and you are a fan of his 80's guitar work, it's going to be one impossible mission to look for a batch of Lightfoot CD's that just feature Terry Clements.

'Tis true about TC's best stuff not available on CD. SOme of my fave TC leads are:
Sea of tranquility, DSR, salute, broken dreams, waiting for you and i'd rather press on. These aren't available on CD (apart from some on songbook but a lot of people wouldn't cough up $AUS100 for 18 tracks that they haven't heard before.

I was listening to cold on the shoulder yesterday and the solo to a tree too weak to stand struck me. That's Red isn't it - not bad work!

Actually Joveski

Salute and Broken Dreams solos were played by Dean Parks. On the Salute album, Terry played lead guitar on Biscuit City and Romance.

To Rebbeca, Erica, Sundreme and all who love Terry, You can't have him.I'm his # 1 fan, and I don't like to share. But if it's the only way. Yes, he does love to cook and he is very sweet,he grows on you.He's not too old for me.He's so fine.I'm so craaazy, craaazy over him.I'll share him with Patsy,Cline.!!

[This message has been edited by Veronica (edited February 13, 2001).]

quote:Originally posted by Veronica:
To Rebbeca, Erica, Sundreme and all who love Terry, You can't have him.I'm his # 1 fan, and I don't like to share. But if it's the only way. Yes, he does love to cook and he is very sweet,he grows on you.He's not too old for me.He's so fine.I'm so craaazy, craaazy over him.I'll share him with Patsy,Cline.!!

[This message has been edited by Veronica (edited February 13, 2001).]

Hi Veronica and welcome aboard,
I guess as fans, we all have to share performers to some degree, but that's ok by me. As far as I'm concerned the more people that appreciate Terry, the better. And he certainly is someone worthy of esteem, both as a skilled musician and as one of the most decent, kind people that I've ever met. As far as being his number one fan...well now there might be some contention about that. I dont know if there is a contest for who holds that title, but if there were, I'm pretty confident that I'd win the belt. http://www.corfid.com/ubb/tongue.gif

Let's see: Gord wants Terry to sit because he is significantly taller than Gord. There is a picture of Gord, Rick Haynes and Red Shea standing side-by-side. Red is significantly shorter than Gord, but sat when he played anyway. I've watched bands where everyone but the drummer, keyboard player and steel player were standing, and it's quite distracting. From personal experience, I know that sitting while playing gives the player a much better focus on his instrument. Having everyone else sit makes Gord the "focal point" (he said this in an interview) for the audience to watch.

------------------